5 series e motor in my is

[BS87]

Please show me a B27 that is not heavily modified, that *safely* goes up to 7000rpm, and i will gladly admit my falseness, and retract my previous post.

[motorprestige]

and it responds very well to light tuning, such as air filter, exhaust, intake/exhaust manifolds. autothority has a minor chip mod that sees it to plus 26whp and plus23ft lbs of torque, as well as raising cutoff to 5600. just a 150$ chip.

[BS87]

I know about the chips. My reasoning is that the eta would tend to ping or detonate around or above 7000rpm

[motorprestige]

yes but with precautionary modifacation, it would produce a lot of power up there. im just saying, it has a lot of potential, im not afraid to go that far, i did it with my b25.

[BS87]

I understand it has a lot of potential. I'm just saying it also has alot of potential to go boom (ofcourse almost any engine does)

Anyway, i'm probably wrong, and i'm about to pass out, so lets continue this some other time. You win for now

[motorprestige]

think about it, with a new cam, pistons, rods, and valves, it would be pretty hard to detonate the b27, maybe lower the air fuel ratio, slightly bigger injectors. it can be very powerful.

[the afro guy]

there are two guys here in perth with b27s that rev up to 8000rpm reliably, have been running for two years and have had no problems, apart from the usual things that go wrong with modded engines. apparently the way to go is to get the head off a 323i along with the intake manifold ecu and exhaust manifold, do a bit of work to it to make it fit properly and have everything match up, its not really that much, get a custom chip made up and you're off and racing. they usually pump out about 210hp like that then you just go from there with all the other bits and pieces. its actually pretty cheap and works well. you just need to know what you're doing and what works best

[MaDhAtTeR]

If you change cams while using the stock head, you need to modify the head. Eta only uses 4 bearings remember?

Mine after it was built would run to 8000. I took it out on a few track days around willowbank. It was useless at 8000 though, it wasnt building any more power or torque, so the limiter was set back to 7000. If you wanted a turbo motor it would be great being able to rev that high. I didnt have stock rods or springs though. Starting to encounter valve bounce with high duration cams at those sort of revs too. Peak power didnt shift alot, it was only up to 6500. torque rose alot though, 5900 hit the mark on the dyno. Pretty neat watching tractive effort, makes you think your car is so much better than it is.... OMG i have 800Nm of torque!

[the afro guy]

Originally posted by MaDhAtTeR
If you change cams while using the stock head, you need to modify the head. Eta only uses 4 bearings remember?

Mine after it was built would run to 8000. I took it out on a few track days around willowbank. It was useless at 8000 though, it wasnt building any more power or torque, so the limiter was set back to 7000. If you wanted a turbo motor it would be great being able to rev that high. I didnt have stock rods or springs though. Starting to encounter valve bounce with high duration cams at those sort of revs too. Peak power didnt shift alot, it was only up to 6500. torque rose alot though, 5900 hit the mark on the dyno. Pretty neat watching tractive effort, makes you think your car is so much better than it is.... OMG i have 800Nm of torque!

so after going through all that, what would you reccomend? eta with an i head that actually does work, or just go for a b25 and mod that?

sounds like the b27 with a head job is more fun though

[BS87]

I guess i stand corrected. I'll admit i was wrong. Good show.

Learn something new everyday.

[DrMcDave]

buy and m50, i have a td crank and turbo manifold but when i think that an s50 would get better gas mileage and be just as fast with a few bolt ons its hard to decide.

but for real the price of m50's have come way down its almost pointless to swap an m20 into any car...also m30 (not sure on number) 535i engine is a good inexpensive swap so i hear. apparently they respond well to bolt ons.

are m30's 12 valve i'd assume yes but i am curious

[MaDhAtTeR]

Originally posted by the afro guy
so after going through all that, what would you reccomend? eta with an i head that actually does work, or just go for a b25 and mod that?

sounds like the b27 with a head job is more fun though

For the money, i wouldnt consider it at all really

But out of them, the eta (super) bottom end with the I head are a match. With the earlier eta, the combustion chamber doesnt match the bore, it can decrease volumetric efficiency, if you are looking for high hp, that will be a problem. Either you go the early eta bottom end and B23 head with modifications, or the super eta bottom end with B25 head.

All the heads will work on each other, it just depends on how much power you want to get out of it.

I spent alot of time working on the head though, i changed cams, new double springs, larger valves, retainers, reground the valves, replaced the rockers, port matched manifolds, polished inlet ports, back of the valves, replaced guides, new injectors, all sorts of little things. I did it because i had the opportunity todo it myself so it didnt cost a thing (only parts). I probably spent over 20 hours ****ing around with the head, it isnt cheap if you get an engineer todo it, and thats before you look at bottom end.

A bloke in chicago brought my whole car complete with engine (was talking to him organising parts). I think the M20 is a great setup for turbo applications, it's already been established it is outdated for NA work, but if you plan for forced induction down the track, build the M20 now and run around in it. They really lend themselves to high boost setups rather cheaply once the engine has been built.

I wouldnt run an M20 again if i didnt plan todo something else to it down the track, it's great to build one that is ballistic, but when you really open it up, i was probably getting 250km's to a tank of petrol (almost 20L of fuel used per 100km's ). Track days were worse with motorsport fuel.

So yeah, either go something newer (an M50 perhaps), or just do the swap with stock parts (unless you plan on a turbo or something down the track). Thats where the conversions came about, you could use pretty much stock parts (keeping costs way down) and still get 150+kw at the crank.

Edit: In reply to the above, yeah M30's are still 12 valve heads. Im planning on going down the track of building an alpina B6, im going to start with the M30 (to keep it sort of original for starters) because the bigger engine has more power and torque to start with. Ive heard cases where the B35 was coaxed out to over 4L Reminds me of the old ford crossflow 6's. Neighbour had one bored out to almost 4 and a half litres, had a huge bloody holley on top, kept wrecking clutches so ford tested it to find out it was putting out over 340hp at the rear wheels Big cast iron lump though, kinda like the M30

[DrMcDave]

how much heavier is the m30.......a 4 liter would be fun, i bet it would have a nice sound to it. i am planning a 2.8 turbo for my ix...will most likely break something but hell i'll figure that out later.

[MaDhAtTeR]

Long motor with accessories, the 3L is about 60 kilograms more than the M20.

[AdamNewbie]

I recently blew up my Eta and i walked all over modded 2.5's, although i had a lot of money into my Eta. Believe it or not dynoed out at 317hp. Please dont make me list what i had done to it...it takes too long. Oh yea and it was N/A. I personally LOVE the 2.7 block, just not the head.